STOP II - Thoughts on the Community
I. Hey folks, Jiquor's back, but not for much longer, (as of right now, anyway.) This forum post is no formal news or notifications on STOP II 1.1 (What the community calls a complete release rather than an incomplete one with hundreds of known issues, which are being fixed heavily day by day.) I took a hiatus from working on STOP II for about two weeks, maybe even longer so I can pursue my current projects and those I'm involved in, GOODBLOX (which shut down, unfortunately,) current work at a bakery in my area (hoping to move stores, really working hard on that right now,) and attempting to pursue college and a career in the food truck business, which plans are going well, I just need people. Damn.
This forum post is a heavily honest view of the community as I see it right now, mostly, which is why I'm posting all this information. It may not really have to do with Marble Blast STOP II itself, but on the community's reaction to the game and what my feelings are about the community after...a couple incidents.
1. I first began Marble Blast STOP II as planned December 2016, which was in development for two weeks, then I took a month hiatus and re-wrote the game from scratch. The original version featured lots of tutorial levels, which was abysmal, so I decided at that time to combine the tutorial levels into six different levels in a separate category rather than to put them in a beginner level packet/sub-folder. Levels took a lot of time to build - when I built 100 beginner levels through trial and error I managed to get them all done in less than 6 months, and let me tell you, I will have to admit that most of testing was done throughout the beginner and intermediate levels. As for the advanced and expert levels, no to little testing was done, and that's something I'm seeking to improve and that's happening with a large community of members from here, my family and friends. We'll all be working together to improve the game and polish it one step at a time. All the levels I built were well received in terms of how they were designed, how the texturing was (almost,) flawless (little errors). What really was well received on the game though was the music, and I'd like to thank hPerks and Tails19935 for their awesome work. Definitely would recommend them to anybody. This project helped improve my building skills, designer skills and (some) coding skills & management skills, which are improving each and every day outside of this project and when I work on this project.
2. Why did I release the game in such as rush?
I shouldn't have, and I never want any of my projects to have a set release date again unless I know they're absolutely close. Let's call it by (example: This project will be released the Third Week of September.) Originally, I wanted to release the game on this specific date after working on it for 1 year and six months, because:
- July 6th was the release of both PQ and Pokemon GO. I wanted to combine this awesome mod with other awesome games that had released before. This was a mistake, although the game is good in some ways, there were a lot of polishing and improvements to be made to make it a hit, (which is happening now.)
- I was about to leave for vacation on July 8th, and was going to be back on July 13th, which happened. Work and preparations for other certain projects were starting to get in the way, so I said "screw it," then and wanted to make my current community happy. I originally said July 6th five months before I released the modification, and I (sorta) got it released on time - the incomplete version.
Surely enough this has taught me some valuable lessons, which are taking into improvement now. There are over 20 things to do on the to-do list for Marble Blast STOP II 1.1, Full Release. There will still be some issues that weren't caught, but that's what the community is for. Before you complain to me about this, take a hard look at games that had known issues and had a release. (GLC3, Pokemon GO, etc.) Games will have bugs without developer knowledge, and we're prepared to fix them if the community tells us what's wrong.
3. Matan's Stream and Feedback from the Community
This is where the honest part about my views to the community comes in. A lot of people were (and still are) enjoying the modification although hype's slowed down because of this upcoming 1.1 Update to Marble Blast STOP II. Feedback arose from lots of people in the small Discord Server for Marble Blast STOP II, such as (Better textures, which I agreed with so Eblu is our new texturing guru, and he's taught me some ins-and-outs on texturing lately, in which I've become much better.) There was even feedback during beta testing (We need a new music guy, this guy's music isn't good!) and (Here's how to texture this, add some scenery here,) and so on. There was lots of positive feedback from many people, and lots of positive comments (and suggestions) for the mod which made the to-do list for 1.1 possible. A bunch of us are working hard right now to make this modification a success.
However, its not easy to say this, and I'm honestly looking for some sort of apology from Matan and other members of the community. Matan ran a stream for Marble Blast STOP II because he apparently "loved the reception to the stream of the first game,) which was terrible in many fields. The reason for STOP I's failure was the reason I began a sequel and seeked to improve my efforts on the modification. I worked day and night, some nights with no sleep, some nights with blistering headaches that wouldn't go away with IBUPROFEN, ASPRIN, etc. My life has become a busy, depressed mess as of lately and there are a few things I do which escape it all, including working on Marble Blast STOP II, taking care of my girlfriend and planning a future with her, and learning to write engines and code from scratch (which is going slow, but its happening, uh, well, slowly, of course, with a little training from courses and Whirligig.)
Sorry for rambling. Back to Matan's Stream. I watched the full stream three weeks or so ago, and there were a few things which disappointed me. First of all, the community (and Matan) was reacting to the game in such a way that was similar to the first game, and this was because of the "reception," to the first stream of the first game. Genuinely, he wanted to mock me and be mean on the stream - put me down even if I worked as hard as I could. Although some of his feedback in mid-stream was actually helpful, nice and responsive, most of his stream flawlessly tore me - its like the community unintentionally WANTED me to give up on the modification. Second of all, anything that was an error in the game (unintentional errors) or anything that was a sequel or a custom level remake, he would throw down "This is unoriginal, this is so good that its bad," etc. While I admit I created custom level remakes, I did these specific remakes because of ACTUAL NEW CHANGES to Marble Blast STOP II and how those custom levels could incorporate those new features. Example: Advanced Level 31 - Space Adventure - instead of using a Gyrocopter to fly around the Asteroids, you would jump on them and go through low-gravity triggers instead. Sure, they were unoriginal ideas, which is why they're removed from the game, but there's nothing wrong with creating sequels and similarities and "Easter Eggs" to levels that previously existed. I've seen many modifications, custom level builders, even Marble Blast Platinum have easter eggs and similarities to previous modifications. In fact, if you actually look at it from a perspective, everything we're doing on this site (PlatinumQuest, Marble Blast STOP II, etc.) is made from original Marble Blast Gold content (engine, cs files and some textures,) so to call ME OUT SPECIFICALLY and say that I'm being unoriginal is hurtful. Third of all, I kept getting mocked for the way I built certain levels on Matan's Stream. Outside his stream, I got lots of good feedback for level design (Where hazards should be, don't put Teapots in stupid places) - take Marble Mutiny for that example. But almost every-other level was Matan rudely mocking me for level design on-stream. At the end of the stream, he ON STREAM threw Marble Blast STOP II away. I'm not sure if he does this with other mods, but this was absolutely unnecessary and it hurt me badly to see that.
(TL;DR) - Matan did this stream in reception to the first Marble Blast STOP Game, which is why he intentionally mocked me, was rude on-stream by saying things like "This is so good, that its bad!" and "This is, like, the worst mod I've ever seen," and so forth. This was so he can get appreciation from his viewers and twitch-rep, etc. He intentionally hurt me by using Twitch to live-stream my game for his own benefit, and after this, this is making me question how he should even be a community leader on Marbleblast.com, or a community leader of any sort. This is NOT okay of a leader to do, and after this, its been giving me lots of honest thoughts.
4. After the Stream
After the stream, some time later I saw this from Derpking.
"Derpking: This stream (like any streamer who is worth is salt) attempts to appease its viewers, which is why any talks of 'must agree with matan' is wrong. I went harsher than usual on purpose to appease my viewers and make them enjoy it. I also played it a full week after everyone else so people can make their own established opinions on the mod. People have already given their own feedback, but yes if they didn't it might be partly because jiquor doesn't take criticism well."
In the past when I worked on Marble Blast STOP I, I took criticism...not so well, especially because of how I received the criticism. I've been much better about it now, as I say to all of you and have said to you ever since I published one of my Marble Blast STOP II threads. But this confirms that Matan went harsher to appease his viewers - to be mean to me, mock me.
In conclusion...
After what I had seen from the community, and after some of the conversations I've seen on the Marble Blast Community Discord about my game (lots of snarky comments in drama-land) and after a couple personal conversations on Discord, especially after seeing the stream and hearing things about the stream, it is my decision, but I think I'm just going to leave this community. If I'm banned for writing honesty about my feelings, and honesty about Matan's Stream, then so be it. Honestly that's just you not wanting to accept my feelings and cover what some members of the community actually did to me, and they very well know. There will be a couple conversations posted in the future that describe other details about the community after the stream-incident (and a couple more things.)
Although I am sticking with my Marble Blast STOP II community because 95% of the feedback has been constructive, written nicely and visuals were given. I love the Discord Server for STOP II. It's really helped me make this game better with all of those nice people. So thank you to those who are there and are reading this.
Finally, a couple of new STOP II Screenshots and...
I will still be posting a link to STOP II somewhere in the near future.
If people actually want me to stick around, I expect better from some of you people, honestly.
Maybe see you guys around,
- Jiquor
This forum post is a heavily honest view of the community as I see it right now, mostly, which is why I'm posting all this information. It may not really have to do with Marble Blast STOP II itself, but on the community's reaction to the game and what my feelings are about the community after...a couple incidents.
1. I first began Marble Blast STOP II as planned December 2016, which was in development for two weeks, then I took a month hiatus and re-wrote the game from scratch. The original version featured lots of tutorial levels, which was abysmal, so I decided at that time to combine the tutorial levels into six different levels in a separate category rather than to put them in a beginner level packet/sub-folder. Levels took a lot of time to build - when I built 100 beginner levels through trial and error I managed to get them all done in less than 6 months, and let me tell you, I will have to admit that most of testing was done throughout the beginner and intermediate levels. As for the advanced and expert levels, no to little testing was done, and that's something I'm seeking to improve and that's happening with a large community of members from here, my family and friends. We'll all be working together to improve the game and polish it one step at a time. All the levels I built were well received in terms of how they were designed, how the texturing was (almost,) flawless (little errors). What really was well received on the game though was the music, and I'd like to thank hPerks and Tails19935 for their awesome work. Definitely would recommend them to anybody. This project helped improve my building skills, designer skills and (some) coding skills & management skills, which are improving each and every day outside of this project and when I work on this project.
2. Why did I release the game in such as rush?
I shouldn't have, and I never want any of my projects to have a set release date again unless I know they're absolutely close. Let's call it by (example: This project will be released the Third Week of September.) Originally, I wanted to release the game on this specific date after working on it for 1 year and six months, because:
- July 6th was the release of both PQ and Pokemon GO. I wanted to combine this awesome mod with other awesome games that had released before. This was a mistake, although the game is good in some ways, there were a lot of polishing and improvements to be made to make it a hit, (which is happening now.)
- I was about to leave for vacation on July 8th, and was going to be back on July 13th, which happened. Work and preparations for other certain projects were starting to get in the way, so I said "screw it," then and wanted to make my current community happy. I originally said July 6th five months before I released the modification, and I (sorta) got it released on time - the incomplete version.
Surely enough this has taught me some valuable lessons, which are taking into improvement now. There are over 20 things to do on the to-do list for Marble Blast STOP II 1.1, Full Release. There will still be some issues that weren't caught, but that's what the community is for. Before you complain to me about this, take a hard look at games that had known issues and had a release. (GLC3, Pokemon GO, etc.) Games will have bugs without developer knowledge, and we're prepared to fix them if the community tells us what's wrong.
3. Matan's Stream and Feedback from the Community
This is where the honest part about my views to the community comes in. A lot of people were (and still are) enjoying the modification although hype's slowed down because of this upcoming 1.1 Update to Marble Blast STOP II. Feedback arose from lots of people in the small Discord Server for Marble Blast STOP II, such as (Better textures, which I agreed with so Eblu is our new texturing guru, and he's taught me some ins-and-outs on texturing lately, in which I've become much better.) There was even feedback during beta testing (We need a new music guy, this guy's music isn't good!) and (Here's how to texture this, add some scenery here,) and so on. There was lots of positive feedback from many people, and lots of positive comments (and suggestions) for the mod which made the to-do list for 1.1 possible. A bunch of us are working hard right now to make this modification a success.
However, its not easy to say this, and I'm honestly looking for some sort of apology from Matan and other members of the community. Matan ran a stream for Marble Blast STOP II because he apparently "loved the reception to the stream of the first game,) which was terrible in many fields. The reason for STOP I's failure was the reason I began a sequel and seeked to improve my efforts on the modification. I worked day and night, some nights with no sleep, some nights with blistering headaches that wouldn't go away with IBUPROFEN, ASPRIN, etc. My life has become a busy, depressed mess as of lately and there are a few things I do which escape it all, including working on Marble Blast STOP II, taking care of my girlfriend and planning a future with her, and learning to write engines and code from scratch (which is going slow, but its happening, uh, well, slowly, of course, with a little training from courses and Whirligig.)
Sorry for rambling. Back to Matan's Stream. I watched the full stream three weeks or so ago, and there were a few things which disappointed me. First of all, the community (and Matan) was reacting to the game in such a way that was similar to the first game, and this was because of the "reception," to the first stream of the first game. Genuinely, he wanted to mock me and be mean on the stream - put me down even if I worked as hard as I could. Although some of his feedback in mid-stream was actually helpful, nice and responsive, most of his stream flawlessly tore me - its like the community unintentionally WANTED me to give up on the modification. Second of all, anything that was an error in the game (unintentional errors) or anything that was a sequel or a custom level remake, he would throw down "This is unoriginal, this is so good that its bad," etc. While I admit I created custom level remakes, I did these specific remakes because of ACTUAL NEW CHANGES to Marble Blast STOP II and how those custom levels could incorporate those new features. Example: Advanced Level 31 - Space Adventure - instead of using a Gyrocopter to fly around the Asteroids, you would jump on them and go through low-gravity triggers instead. Sure, they were unoriginal ideas, which is why they're removed from the game, but there's nothing wrong with creating sequels and similarities and "Easter Eggs" to levels that previously existed. I've seen many modifications, custom level builders, even Marble Blast Platinum have easter eggs and similarities to previous modifications. In fact, if you actually look at it from a perspective, everything we're doing on this site (PlatinumQuest, Marble Blast STOP II, etc.) is made from original Marble Blast Gold content (engine, cs files and some textures,) so to call ME OUT SPECIFICALLY and say that I'm being unoriginal is hurtful. Third of all, I kept getting mocked for the way I built certain levels on Matan's Stream. Outside his stream, I got lots of good feedback for level design (Where hazards should be, don't put Teapots in stupid places) - take Marble Mutiny for that example. But almost every-other level was Matan rudely mocking me for level design on-stream. At the end of the stream, he ON STREAM threw Marble Blast STOP II away. I'm not sure if he does this with other mods, but this was absolutely unnecessary and it hurt me badly to see that.
(TL;DR) - Matan did this stream in reception to the first Marble Blast STOP Game, which is why he intentionally mocked me, was rude on-stream by saying things like "This is so good, that its bad!" and "This is, like, the worst mod I've ever seen," and so forth. This was so he can get appreciation from his viewers and twitch-rep, etc. He intentionally hurt me by using Twitch to live-stream my game for his own benefit, and after this, this is making me question how he should even be a community leader on Marbleblast.com, or a community leader of any sort. This is NOT okay of a leader to do, and after this, its been giving me lots of honest thoughts.
4. After the Stream
After the stream, some time later I saw this from Derpking.
"Derpking: This stream (like any streamer who is worth is salt) attempts to appease its viewers, which is why any talks of 'must agree with matan' is wrong. I went harsher than usual on purpose to appease my viewers and make them enjoy it. I also played it a full week after everyone else so people can make their own established opinions on the mod. People have already given their own feedback, but yes if they didn't it might be partly because jiquor doesn't take criticism well."
In the past when I worked on Marble Blast STOP I, I took criticism...not so well, especially because of how I received the criticism. I've been much better about it now, as I say to all of you and have said to you ever since I published one of my Marble Blast STOP II threads. But this confirms that Matan went harsher to appease his viewers - to be mean to me, mock me.
In conclusion...
After what I had seen from the community, and after some of the conversations I've seen on the Marble Blast Community Discord about my game (lots of snarky comments in drama-land) and after a couple personal conversations on Discord, especially after seeing the stream and hearing things about the stream, it is my decision, but I think I'm just going to leave this community. If I'm banned for writing honesty about my feelings, and honesty about Matan's Stream, then so be it. Honestly that's just you not wanting to accept my feelings and cover what some members of the community actually did to me, and they very well know. There will be a couple conversations posted in the future that describe other details about the community after the stream-incident (and a couple more things.)
Although I am sticking with my Marble Blast STOP II community because 95% of the feedback has been constructive, written nicely and visuals were given. I love the Discord Server for STOP II. It's really helped me make this game better with all of those nice people. So thank you to those who are there and are reading this.
Finally, a couple of new STOP II Screenshots and...
I will still be posting a link to STOP II somewhere in the near future.
If people actually want me to stick around, I expect better from some of you people, honestly.
Maybe see you guys around,
- Jiquor
STOPX Creator. Getting better by every release.
